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Score : 41

Revert osa, biggest mistake on a class rework ever

By godsonrowan - SUBSCRIBER - May 18, 2017, 15:36:23
Get rid of all the bonuses and shit they get from killing a summon, they already refund the ap and gain control over the shittest ai known to mankind, like for real ?? infinite jumps as agi, strongest heals in game as int ?? WTF ??
Reactions 14
Score : 5118
1 jump/turn as agi, that's been nerfed not that long ago. To have the strongest heals, the osa needs to be in dragon form and the healed target needs to be near an enemy, which guarantees the target will take damage anyway, and the dragons need to have LoS for the target. Otherwise, osa heals are so situational I actually place them as third best healers in the game, eni and eca winning due to their heals being not nearly as limited. In fact, sadida might be a better healer too, since their heals are easier to set up and snowball a whole lot harder.

You should learn how their spells actually work before complaining.
Score : 1061
Before you look what is strong in different element, you should also know that they lose something in return.

Int osa with flat heals is the best healer in the game, but their damage is crap. Their spells have low base dmg and due to being in dragon form you also lose 20% final damage.

Agility osa got the movement and damage, but they lose their sustain. So if you can lock them down their squishy and easy to kill.

Earth osa is extreemly tanky but they lose their movement.

Osamodas is 3 roles in one but you have to choose which one you want and deal with the debufs.

like

"Oh my team loses allot of hp everyfight, i really need a burst of heals.. But i will lose my damage out put by a ton.. Is the risk worth it if we don't have much damage sustain ?"

"Oh we don't have allot of movement control abilities in my team i should go air and have a ton of damage.. But is it worth it if my team is close combat and i get killed very fast"

"We really need a tank to let my team stay in the back and do ranged damage (( cra enu you know)) But i wont be very quick somewhere, if an ally gets caught i cant quicky rotate over."

Stuff like that you know. I think osamodas are balanced since they have to make rough choices to be able to exell in one case then be terrible in the other case.

smile thats it i guess ?
Score : 205
to check i putted a decent resist and vit set with 1400 int on my osa with a cloudy and 6ra on set, besides the dragons and the perfect heals and the 50% res with a croum, i already did 3k damage on insane range.

I agree with this topic, there is NO class which has a 100% win rate versus an Osamodas. to be honest, no class win vs a HP/% res osa. It's just a cheap way to be Overpowered.

Back in the days you had good PVP, some classes who had their weakenesses against others.

some examples:
eni/enu > iop
sram>enu
sadi>enu
panda>xelor
panda/enu > feca
feca> iop/eca

Nowadays a single iops with hp and emerald dofus is able to crush all his counters, and feca's who are 100% PVP players cant even win a fight anymore against any damage dealers since they all fuck up his erosion straight thru the shields. I can tell, had a 220 lock 35% res 5k vit feca, should be a great set year(s) ago, but i changed my class since i had no chance of winning against osas iops huppers ecas srams and ouginaks. Since they are OP in pvp. Dont forget to add the sac to this 6 classes.

AND THEN U HAVE THE OSA: Captain of the unbalanced PVP.

yesterday i faced 5 several osa's in pvp, my eca nor fogger can do 3-4k damage in a turn, my eca eroded their asses in 1vs1, and guess what? next turn they were full HP again, and to punish me for trying to blitz them he just adds 3 other monsters including the resurrection, wherefor he doesnt even gets -res when he summons a creature back.

this osa boy had like 6k hp and 40% overall? he didnt even need any statistics to win the fight lmao. could have 41 int and still full heal his ass every turn again and again.
and then there is this bullshit with the tofus who teleport and push 10 range between you and the osa even if he is in another state, and gobbals who gravite your ass and prefent you from even getting close to the osa. It is a cheap way to never lose, just no brain. Dont know why it would be fun to pvp on an Osa anyways..

Nerf that shit, you got my vote

Ideas for a nerf:
apply the osa 2% erosion for everytime he cast a summon.
a self-heal penalty. max 50% of your hp or something.
max 2/3 element on summons, not turn 1 2 dragons, turn 2 2 gobbals and turn 3 2 tofus and a dopple. fuck off with that

another addition, i tried something else and build a cha pvp ougi to crush the osa's summons. So i killed all of his summons (6) with 8 AP and got the osa on close combat. But guess what? next turn he was on 20 range again with 3 summons in the field.
Score : 1061
1. You're building a damage osa right now right?? You know you have to think 20%- final damage on that 3k dmg smile Also if you actually really looked into osamodas their spells you know their 2 ap heal spell has very low base stats and their damage is medium. Agility is way better off with damage.
2. This is all based on 1vs1 pvp and the mods already said "Nothing will be balanced on 1vs1 pvp"
3. you went an ouginak and still lost.. you're really special aint ya ? You know that cha ouginaks are the most stupidest thing you can go? Go figure why you lost smile I play an ouginak lv 200 right now str/agi and i wreck every osa i can see. Also range shouldnt be a problem with ouginak since you can teleport everytime and pull them to you.
4. Also your feca's resist arent that good if you want to go full pvp your resist must be 40%- 50% and erosion shouldnt be that bad if you had more ap /mp reduction so you could reap the enemy so they dont have enough ap to use erosion.

And now the nerfs you had in mind lets read it

apply the osa 2% erosion for everytime he cast a summon. : This is the most stupidest thing i have ever read in my life. Know why enirispa's dont have erosion anymore for healing ? Because it doesn't work out well. Also osa is a very spammy class with their summons. But its just a few of the things they got going for themselves.

a self-heal penalty. max 50% of your hp or something. If this was purely for pvp i wouldnt mind a lower % heal on self heals by like 75% heal instead of 100% heal but... in pvm this would make the fire osamodas useless. Want to know why ? If you got an int osamodas as healer, they got a really big problem keeping themselves alive since they have to get their summons out to heal up. Also their dragons can only heal 1 time a turn for all the dragons. This means you cant spam the heal in 1 turn. 1 turn = 1 heal. Also for the other heals you have to get close combat with the monster which you dont do in pvm. Also only 1 of the summons do the area heal when damaging the enemy unless the osamodas especially puts a spell on them. But you dont do much damage at all as int osamodas.

max 2/3 element on summons, not turn 1 2 dragons, turn 2 2 gobbals and turn 3 2 tofus and a dopple. fuck off with that. Really dude? They already put a limitation that you can only summon 1 family of the same summons. And if he doesnt change or does change the other summons wont get any improvement on their damage , since their not copying your stats. also their going with their shitty ai since you have to spam spells to even control them.

another addition, i tried something else and build a cha pvp ougi to crush the osa's summons. So i killed all of his summons (6) with 8 AP and got the osa on close combat. But guess what? next turn he was on 20 range again with 3 summons in the field.
Really ??? Please read that for a moment.

Cha ouginak in pvp.. And you went close combat?????????? The only thing cha has going for them is that their ranged, the damage is medium as heck and their rage spell doesnt work well with the rest of their kit with cha. If you want to get close to someone use every element but cha.
Score : 205
Well, since my ouginak is agi/lock or agi/str and i still lose against those osa's, i tried cha for the high AoE damage around yourself, but even that was not enough for countering those summons. Its unbalanced, Period.

and in addition, try PVP osas on -1,0 in Echo, not Osa's from other servers in 1vs1 kolo.
Score : 5118
So, the class that excels at focusing on a single target can't solo the class that summons multiple allies on a game where 1x1 isn't balanced. What a shocker. It doesn't matter if you 1x1 on kolo or on -1,0 (in fact, there's an argument that -1,0 is even less relevant to balance because it accomplishes absolutely nothing), it will still not be the basis for balance. So, start talking about group settings or just quit complaining, because as is, you're wasting everyone's time.
Score : 1705
The only reason why somebody would argue that Osas are not OP is because they play Osas themselves.
"Devs will not balance classes based on 1v1" What an argument. That does not change the fact the people are abusing the crap out of this class to win on Kolo.
Score : 5118
Out of all the classes I own (and I own them all), osa is the lowest level, so that argument is not only pointless, it's also moot. It's less relevant than saying 1x1 is not supposed to be balanced, since that is actually something the devs themselves said and complaining about it is pointless. In group settings, dealing with summons is easier, and so is rushing the osa. So, to actually have a case about osas being OP, you need to talk about what makes them OP in a group setting. "Oh, they heal too much!" Easily avoidable, easily punishable, less reliable than sadidas. In fact, I honestly think sadidas are a lot worse than osas (and sadida is my 7th higher level character, btw, again showing how me owning doesn't have anything to do with my opinions on balance). They heal better, clog the field better, snowball harder, have better support options...
Score : 177
All summons are broken OSAS + SADIS because there is no LIMIT on summons exos, when u kill a summon they can just summon two more in its place, ridiculous in 1v1 KOLO, even that oug dog thing is broken they all have LOCK so you cant really chase them down without them chucking those summons in your way like the block,gobbal etc, NERF the summon limit and NERF the summons HP like seriously 1600 hp on gobbal 900 on yapper both have lock and res, Ankama buffs cra instead of doing the necessary thing to just give summons a nerf.

ALL Summons should have 300-400 hp, not 900+ seriously u spend 6ap killing a summon when they can just resummon it for 3-5ap and deal damage to you and run away? what kind of balance is that? how does it take any skill in pvp when you just summon and run? the only summon that takes skill to use is groot, that is the only thing that isnt broken everything else is just broken, UP dolls -mp stacks infinite times means u cant even move if they have 2-3 of them.

1. Nerf summon limit to 4
2. Nerf summons hp to 300-400hp
3. Get rid of all the lock on all summons besides the block coz thats what his meant to do.
4. UP Dolls should not be able to stack mp theft, you can balance this by making all summons to 1 type on the map at a time. ie. You cannot summon 2 UP dolls on the map at once, or 2 of any other summon
5. Thats how you really BALANCE a class.
Score : 1618
Lynn-Reiginleif|2017-05-24 01:55:26
what makes them OP in a group setting.
They dominate the 3v3 kolo leader boards.

Also a cap on summons exos is probably a good idea.
Score : 30176
To make it fair, if there will be a cap on the damage potential of summoners, there should also be a cap on the damage potential of direct damage class.

Or not... Just git gud and learn how to beat summoners because simply killing their summons is not the answer.
Score : 5118
justapie|2017-06-04 03:58:49
Lynn-Reiginleif|2017-05-24 01:55:26
what makes them OP in a group setting.
They dominate the 3v3 kolo leader boards.
That's consequence at best, not cause. To know what nerfs should happen, if any, we need to know what the cause is. Blind nerfing is stupid, as proven by the rage 3 nerf on beta (rage 3 was never the issue with ougis).

@Patwick:
1-Yeah, becase it makes a lot of sense for summoners to not be able to summon.
2-Sure, let's make summons that cost 3+ AP and have idiotic AI killable with 2 AP, including the summons that are supposed to tank.
3-Most summons have very low lock; the ones that do are supposed to lock (gob, double, pandawasta, block) or are agility based and very frail (tofus). If you're having issues dodging any other summon, your dodge is way too low.
4-As far as I know, they don't. The effects cancel each other, like fate of ecaflip. Or so it was last time I played sadida, anyway.
5- No, that's how you make summoners useless. Osas were like that before revamp (minus summon restrictions), and they were buff bots. Sadidas also had nearly useless summons before their revamp. The summons now are actually useful. So what you want is for summons to be useless again, but since osa support was nerfed, and you want even more summoning restrictions (remember, osas already can only summon from one monster family and generally have to kill their own summons, and sadida can only summon one tree per turn, so only 1 summon per turn), they would be in a worse state than pre revamp. Which was atrocious. So, no, that's not how you balance anything. That's how you kill two classes. So I suggest you think about the osa and sadida side of things before you ask for nerfs.
Score : 1196
Lynn-Reiginleif|2017-06-04 08:07:52
justapie|2017-06-04 03:58:49
Lynn-Reiginleif|2017-05-24 01:55:26
what makes them OP in a group setting.
They dominate the 3v3 kolo leader boards.

4-As far as I know, they don't. The effects cancel each other, like fate of ecaflip. Or so it was last time I played sadida, anyway.


The UP dolls MP removal stacks

Source: Click here

I had this 60 turn long fight where i could not move at all, and with no LoS(So many trees, dont know why that should be allowed) or enough range to kill i pretty much sat there doing nothing, and even if the UPs came closer for me to kill, by that time he could summon another UP.

Not only that to kill a sadi you will need to erode them, and me not being able to get to 1-3 range is kinda tedius. The fight went for 1.5hours and eventually he had to leave either out of boredem or he had work or school or something.
Score : 1883
Sadidass are nearly useless in a lot of endgame and near endgame content as monsters have various effects that make summoning Maddoll a bad idea and Ultra-Powerful basically useless.

Summoners can't really be balanced effectively for 1v1 play. It's just not a reasonable proposition.

Also, Sadida is slow and takes a lot of setup to work out properly and pretty much any player near level 200 should be able to take out the summon very quickly. Sadida has a limit of one per turn and it generally costs 7 AP early on sonce you have tp summon a tree and use Tear. Just bust summons immediately and you will beat them.
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