I created a discussion thread yesterday evening, inviting you all to present your feedback directly to the devs on the FR forum. There are details as to why we are trying this approach, as well as a rough translation of the opening posts of each thread, with their respective links.
I know some of you have already posted your Sacrier/Osa comments in this forum, but I would kindly urge you to post them on the French forum also, in the appropriate discussion threads.
Manaia
Personally, the ugly transformation killed osa for me. I know Dofus is a wacky game, but there is a big difference between being wacky-looking and being ugly.
Suggestion: Allow players to customize their transformation so that non-osa users can exercise their rights to choose the ugly transformation while actual osa users can choose transformations that actually looks good.
But then again, I have never played the "old" Sacrier so perhaps people know if this change would do any good for the high levels/endgame?
As for Osamodas - I was planning on eventually giving the class a try but I’ve put those plans on hold until I see what happens to the class at the end of this... balancing. In its current beta form it hardly seems like a summoner anymore but rather a pseudo-summoner who is expected to stay within the combat with a limited number of summons, especially at lower/mid levels. Aka an active fighter who has a small amount of creatures to help out and is expected to stay in what is pretty much melee range of everything if they want their summons/allies to have a boost, if they happen to be close to an enemy, not a summoner who *summons* creatures to do most of the fighting for them. Not the other way around... who inspired those changes? PvP players who couldn’t stand the summoner playing the way they were intended to and how the class lore would indicate they would, and now the PvE players can deal with the mess that’s left behind by their biased, unfair judgement of which the only result is just having the class reworked from the ground up effectively turning it into an active combat class with pseudo summoning capabilities, pretty much equaling a nerf(compared to its original) even if you call it reworking/balancing the class? Count Razof will be a lot more of a pain with this change to the Osa and I have not even done the dungeon myself yet. Unless you have another class able to get a lot of summons out such as Rogues with their bombs. Once again it looks like the PvP crowd gets its will and the PvE players are left to pick up the pieces of the mess that ensues/ensued. Why can’t both be separate in class/spell balancing? Is it not possible? You might as well have called this “Osamodas” a new class for all intents and purposes. I don’t see a summoner here, not a master of creatures, but a Iop who has just gotten a few creatures helping him occasionally. Not literally like a Iop but basically, an active close combat fighter if your allies and/or summons are close to the enemies. The gameplay is supposed to be more supporting to your allies but due to the very restricted range of the buffs it just seems unnecessarily restrictive.
Oh, and really... calling what used to be the black creatures “melanic” now? What kind of word is that anyway? It sounds so stupid. Sorry for being frank but that’s what I think about it.
And while I mostly find the Osa transformations to be not that bad looking(except for the Toad transformation which looks absolutely gross) you should look at what the actual Osa players are saying in regards to the transformations. It doesn’t seem like many, if any, really wanted them under the form they exist now. And I would also agree with those saying they would rather look at their char than these transformations. The visual change could be more subtle. Why couldn’t Tofus be sitting on the Osa if they are in the Tofu transformation thingy, a Gobbly near them for Gobballs, a small dragon for the Wyrmling... not sure for Toads, they all look ugly. Hm, well... for a class I don’t even play and only had intentions to try this is quite a bit of text.
As a sac with 14years experience i have to sey that i rrly like that changes. its like back to roots. im in love with spells lik: Retributon, Bloodthirsty MAdness, Riposte.
unfortunately there are a few things to change here.
the biggest problem has always been erossion. sice frigost this mechanic has taken us away from end-game dungs. i was gratefull when u removed self-erosion.to be honest after that we had a great time on end-game dungs. For us- SACS, there is only 2 ways to fight in end-game: Tank or kait. we had enough survi to tank bosses like solar, protozor etc (% survi, shields- our protector role in team) and even then it wasnt easy to manage and as we know in fights like this its all about erosion.. Also when we couldnt tank, we still could try to use strategy: get in mele/short rang- hit- run, kaiting.
"We also hope that all of these changes will allow Sacriers to find a place for themselves in PvM, especially at higher and very high levels, where they are currently having difficulties."- WHAT?! we were fine..
but ok, just tell me how u see it? u just force us to drop protector role and focus on dmg and positioning (pandas, iops, cras, rogals, xels can do it better btw..).
New suffering basicly gives us %dmg and % sustain in exchange of hp but in fackt we loosing much more than hp. Check this:
1) self-dmg -> we losing more max hp (even without extra erosion there is 10% of natural erosion), but ok, here we can avoid to use those spells.
2) erosion makes ours hp on hight % (even on 100%!) which means that we do not receive benefits from suffering -> how to tank without %sustain? here we cant do anythink
3) bleeding system got big hole and it should be replaced by suffering. we need bleeding to get shield but there is only 1 spell which suporting bleeding and its offensive buff which we dont need durning tanking (gives power in exchange of hp ). also that spell is a variant of gravity. So to get shield we have to lose extra hp and tank tool (gravity). to sey more if we will pick graviti, we cant pick shield becaouse it doesnt work (we doesnt have bleeding..). So we got 2 tank tools which doesnt work togheter.
in 1 word: we losing 3 spells to get shields..its stupid, it even doesnt have sens.
so it is rrly worth? i think it needs some more work and grinding.
summary:
1- you have to make suffering mechanick more resistant to erosion, atleast self-dmg spells doesnt affeckt on max hp.
2- do smothink with bleeding system,its useless now.
Greetings, Sheol
P.s
sorry for text wall
for the last hour ive been looking for what these buffs are but cant find anything. Even in-game its jsut random letters and numbers where the buff should be. I know it's a beta but theres a lot of info missing.
Having more spells that can either give or use up the bleeding stacks would make for more compelling game play and more choices. Either using up blood stacks to heal up or do even more damage to survive or have better map manipulation.
I do love the idea of having more dmg and reduced dmg taken at lower lvls of hp but with the system working based off % hp, erosion can seriously screw a sac up. We lose out on our dmg and resist while also taking dmg. I know this sounds broken but maybe having an ability that uses up blood stacks to bring back some of our erosion hp(without healing us) to somehow mitigate it. That will help us keep a good amount of max hp so we can actually utilize the new hp mechanic(since our dmg and resist is going to rely on our hp now).
the previous problem with suffering as you stated was that it was always one way since the start of the fight(positive suffering or negative suffering) since it took too long to switch and just wasted moves. I think another problem was from it being a 100% uptime buff that we had changing a large amount of abilities. With something like blood stacks that we get from using certain spells and then using them up like a battery to be recharged is a good way to make people think on how they should spend blood stacks. Either using it for a really strong shield from coagulation because you know you are going to take alot of damage or using the charges to do some extra dmg to end a fight faster or manipulating the map to have a more favorable setup. For limitations things like certain spells needing a certain amount of blood stacks. Using up blood stacks makes you unable to get more blood stacks for 1 turn. Taking more bleed damage the higher blood stacks you have so you are forced to use them or take more dmg at the start of your next turn.
These are just ideas and i know are hard to balance and add to the game. But i think they would add another lvl of game play on top of managing our new resource(HP)
The UGLY transformation is bad enough for existing. But we're still forced to transform into that disgusting avatar to play Osa properly. Terrible.
Not to mention this revamp isn't what Osa is even about. They're a summoning class. Now we can only summon by building up charges by attack spells? Makes no sense lore-wise. Transforming has already been an issue with the lore too. Animal tamers. Right.
Remove the UGLY transformations at least. For the love of Osamodas himself.
Anyone else remember the days of activating your punishments then having one round for your dancing sword and the rest of your team wail on you with gobbal swords and leek pie? You could get broken stats for the rest of the fight... unless you got unbewitched, in which case you were completely useless
Good times!
Anyways, anecdotes aside, I really like this version of the sacrier. It feels right.
The new spells are quite interesting and selecting between them feels more balanced and appropriate.
I like the elemental themes set out as well.
I must concur with others that Coagulation using Mutilation bleed stacks to buff it feels awkward. It's a cool mechanic but if you want to play super tanky (How I like to fight), it makes selecting Punishment feel bad.
Suggestions for tweaking:
A. Make Punishment heal slightly more but also give it the bleed property (this feels extremely Sacrier. Heal through bloodletting). That way if you want to run coagulation you don't feel obligated to run one other.
B. Remove Coagulation consuming bleed stacks and instead utilize the Punishment system. Provide a decent amount of shields based on the current punishment level, but remove the damage bonus provided from the punishment stacks until the end of the next turn. Effectively trade away your decent damage potential to be able to tank big hits for one more round.
I created a discussion thread yesterday evening, inviting you all to present your feedback directly to the devs on the FR forum. There are details as to why we are trying this approach, as well as a rough translation of the opening posts of each thread, with their respective links.
I know some of you have already posted your Sacrier/Osa comments in this forum, but I would kindly urge you to post them on the French forum also, in the appropriate discussion threads.
Manaia
Bring back the old summons. Just allow one summon at a time. And make the summon really hard to kill and make the summons all support summons except dopple.
Give osa a strong crackler punch, the crow spell and buffs. Allow the osa to do fusion if you must but make them look cool. Allow extra attack or spells when fused. I promise the community will like this way more than what youve done.
For those of you who want access to the Dofus beta, you can just google "Dofus Beta Download" and find a link to a post that Ankama made with the download link in it.
I think that you're doing something wrong, my transformation always buffs my allies around me. Also, you get buffed from the transformation too. It consistently buffs other players and summons when I transform.