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[Devblog] Infinite Dreams: we're erasing everything and starting over from scratch!

By [Ankama]DOFUS - ADMIN - November 22, 2019, 15:30:00
DevTracker AnkaTracker Announcements

To celebrate its first anniversary, the well of infinite dreams is treating itself to a little restructuring session, along with a nice reward bath. Today, I'd like to invite you to discover the improvements planned for this feature in the year-end update. Hold on tight, we're beginning our descent into the depths of the well.

TL;DR

Three most important things:

  1. To ensure the transition, all dream instances will be reset in the next update. While you can, enjoy and reach your personal goals and even buy some legends. On the day of the update, everyone will have to start a new exploration of the Well of Infinite Dreams. 
  2. If you saved up on reflections to buy something  in the bazaar, you might want to hurry up and spend those reflections because they will no longer be used for that after the update.
  3. A patch for some adjustments will be planned a few weeks after the 2.54 update is deployed. It will mainly concern prices and probabilities of certain bonuses and/or services appearing in the bazaar, as well as the cost of defeat.


 

The end of two currencies

In this new version of Infinite Dreams, dream reflections are no more and will be replaced by dream points, which will now be the feature's only currency. Dream points can still be used to purchase upgrades or services in the bazaar. Reflections still exist, but they are now a dream resource like any other. Also, you have to obtain them differently.

Whether it's dream points or this new way of earning reflections, all your winnings in Infinite Dreams will now be governed by a new feature: the difficulty score.

Difficulty Score

The first new thing you'll discover in the Infinite Dreams will no doubt be the difficulty score. This score determines the quantity and quality of your winnings and is displayed on each room. It is calculated based on the current level and takes into account the following parameters:

  • The difficulty of the dungeon keeper(s)
  • The difficulty of the map for this (these) keeper(s)
  • The difficulty of the current modifier (Dream, Paradox, etc.)

By being calculated like this, the score influences your exploration in two ways. First, this score and this score alone determines the purchases you will be offered in the bazaar, which means that the quality of the proposed purchases will now better reflect your exploration. It goes for all keepers.

  • Currently, in 2.53, each keeper is limited to a dozen possible purchases, and this list never changes. In 2.54, all purchases may become available to each keeper if the difficulty score is high enough. Indeed, Vortex (considered more difficult) is much more likely to offer better opportunities than Royal Gobball, at the same level!


The score also determines your winnings in dream points. For each level, we've set a minimum for this winning. From there, you earn +1% dream points for each point you score above the current level. Conversely, you earn -1% dream points for each point you score below the current level.
 

  • For example, a room with a score of 224 at level 200 means you earn +24% dream points.

The last thing that will influence the score is the loot at the end of a fight. That's right: I said loot! The loot is where you're going to find old purchases in dream points. But before we get started on that topic, let's review our geography a little.

Before Infinite Dreams

We lied to you a little: until now, you never really set foot in Infinite Dreams. Technically, Infinite Dreams is the last of the five sectors that make up the inside of the Well of Infinite Dreams. To better understand, take a look at the all-new map that will accompany you in-game.

The new Dreams Map reveals lights up as you advance!

The Well of Infinite Dreams gets its name from the last of the five sectors. Each one corresponds to a series of levels:

  1. Dream Thoughts: levels 50 to 229
  2. Fantastic Ballads: levels 230 to 269
  3. Imaginary Spaces: levels 270 to 324
  4. Misty Concepts: levels 325 to 399
  5. Infinite Dreams: levels 400 and up

Your goal is more evident now: reach the centre of the well, the infinite dreams. On your way, you will obtain numerous rewards that will be influenced by these sectors.

New loot: become drug traffickers

At the end of each fight, you will obtain a chest that contains items that are determined at random, based on the sector and difficulty level of your fight.

The interface is simplified to focus on the score.

The higher your score is over the current level, the greater chance you have of winning a better quality chest. Thanks to these new evolving chest contents, you no longer have to rely on luck, and you can see which rooms will be sure to give you a better quality chest. Pretty handy, eh?

 

Sector Easy Difficult Very Difficult
Dream Thoughts
Levels 200 to 229 
Fantastic Ballads
Levels 230 to 269
Imaginary Spaces
Levels 270 to 324
Misty Concepts
Levels 325 to 399
Infinite Dreams
Levels 400+
                              
The Narkasseths, Narkofrets and Narkes are going to send you... dreaming!
 

In total, there are twelve chests distributed throughout the well's first four sectors. Inside them, you'll mainly find dream reflections and new magic stones called raw prysmaradites. The luckiest of you will also find items to makes runes, and perhaps legends even!

Once inside Infinite Dreams, there will be no more chests. With no more rewards available, this gloomy sector at the bottom of the well is reserved for brave players in search of ultimate recognition. Down here, you will earn infinite reflections, which will help you unlock an all-new ornament!

If you're the kind of person who seeks riches more than glory, we can now talk a little about the content of these chests.

Dream items

Inside the chests, you'll find a lot of familiar resources, except for prysmaradites, which are going to change your equipment a little! Here is a list of everything you can expect to find when you open a chest:

  • Dream reflections
  • A raw prysmaradite
  • An astral rune
  • A uchronic elixir
  • A legend
  • An animal legend

The astral runes

Astral runes are new resources that help make transcendence runes. Just combine one of the six astral runes with a classic rune to make the corresponding transcendence rune. This slight modification allows us to avoid overloading chests with all the different existing runes.

Prysmaradites

New to this update, prysmaradites are equipment made by artificers from raw prysmaradite and dream reflections. With these crafted stones, we want to explore a new way of thinking about equipment slots.

Prysmaradites share the first slot intended for Dofus and Trophies with the former, and their effects have a common theme: the start of the fight. Most prysmaradites offer bonuses during the first turn or first few turns of play.

Limiting these items to one slot allows us to offer you a wide variety of effects with the same theme, without fearing abuse of synergetic effects.

Other changes

An assumed advanced feature

Beginning with the next update, you will have to start dreams at level 200 or higher to be able to earn chests or infinite reflections. If you are at level 200, nothing changes for you. If you are not at level 200, you will be able to choose between starting a classic 200-level exploration or a training exploration at your level. The training exploration allows you to complete quest goals or earn experience at your level, but you cannot earn chests or infinite reflections at the end of a fight.

We believe that, besides making it very hard to balance winnings, the old way made it seem like the well of infinite dreams was a feature accessible for all levels. In practice, to make the most of the content, one must complete the rest of the game.

End of insurance

Defeat insurance bids you farewell and will be replaced by a new system. When you lose a fight in a room, you will be locked out. To regain access to the room, you must pay a certain amount of dream points, which will increase each time you get locked out. With this new system, you can try each fight at least once with losing dream points.

Monster placements and fight challenges

Monster placements and fight challenges no longer vary from one battle to another to allow you to rework your strategy under the same conditions. If these don't suit you, you will now be able to draw new ones at random through a service in the bazaar. This service is always present and can be purchased as many times as necessary.

Idols

Idols will have a reduced impact on the experience and infinite reflections gains. Dream points will no longer be affected, nor will chests. While this measure goes against the idols contract (which promised to increase experience and loot), we think that it is crucial to maintaining a good balance to Infinite Dreams. That's why we've limited the influence of idols to experience and infinite reflections.

The issue with dream reflections

Twelve months generating reflections with the old system has left us with a considerable problem. The number of dream reflections is way bigger than makes sense now. That's why we've decided to suspend dream reflections between update 2.53 and update 2.54.
 

Dream Reflection 2.54 Forgotten reflection (Dream Reflection 2.53)
 
->
 

All dream reflections will become forgotten reflections, and you will no longer be able to use them in crafting activities or quests. Dream Reflections 2.0 is coming to take their place in an all-new efficient type of reflection. Because eliminating them would have been unfair to you, you will be able to use your existing reflections to purchase six ceremonial shields that will soon be available as rare drop items in Infinite Dreams. This is far from a perfect solution, but it will allow you to make money from your reflections without creating a new negative impact on Infinite Dreams.

Resuming or starting over

Many of you brought it to our attention, and we've made it so that resuming and starting over are no longer next to each other on the same line. No more mix-ups! Now you can resume your exploration by clicking right on the well behind Draconiros.

Astral calm

This new modifier, which gives no bonus to monsters, makes the first levels easier. Nothing better for getting warmed up before you move on to more serious things!

The last word

It's time to bring this devblog on Infinite Dreams to a close! As I write these lines, the beta of these features should soon be online. Bearing that in mind, I invite you all to give us feedback in the forum's beta section.

Starbender  (๑•̀ㅂ•́)و✧

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Reactions 16
Score : -43

We dont care about those new content, we want a new class. Something that poeple will want return DOFUS bcause your game is dying !!!!!!

0 -11
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Score : 204

I care about new updates smile Especially when they involve making improvement to the game. You think we really need a new class?! There are 18 in game already... what kind of class do you think would be a good addition?

It's news to me the game is dying... what server do you play?

4 0
Score : 1882

We want a Kaniger class! (nah jk, just a lil' vibe the trailer gave me tongue)

Thanks for sharing this devblog Ankama! 

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Score : 2327

Looks like a great improvement!

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Score : 1782

Are class changes following soon-ish? Or is that for another update. Just curious smile

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Score : 6112

Best change is no longer feeling the need to use idols in infinite dreams. That was sure annoying...

Also, can I get clarification on "Prysmaradites share the first slot intended for Dofus and Trophies with the former"?

Former, as in it's shared with dofus but not trophies? And by share, you mean both take up the same slot? I'm a bit confused about what this means.

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Score : 188

In the beginning it says "If you saved up on reflections to buy something in the bazaar, you might want to hurry up and spend those reflections because they will no longer be used for that after the update."

But towards the end it says "Because eliminating them would have been unfair to you, you will be able to use your existing reflections to purchase six ceremonial shields that will soon be available as rare drop items in Infinite Dreams."

Why would I spend all my old reflections saved up if I can buy the new ceremonial shields that are coming with the update?

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Score : 1

@Azaknami, ist still pretty unfair to Limit the use to ceremonial items only, thats why they ask to spend them as fast as possible i believe.

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Score : 90
Removing Defeat Insurance is a Poor Decision - Here's Why

I think there's a deep divide between what most advanced PvM players enjoy and what the devs think we enjoy.

When given the choice of getting +25 Agility by beating an easy Kardorim room on the first attempt, or wiping 80 times on a Queen of Thieves+Tengu Snowfoux room for a +50 Agility buff - we choose the latter.

And it should be obvious why - after accumulating billions of kamas worth of gear, very little of the game's content remains challenging - and that's why players turn to self-created challenges like soloing high-end dungeons or getting all achievements with leechers in a single run.

The brilliance in the design of the Infinite Dreams is providing a system that rewards completing fights that are difficult - without completely breaking the economy - by making the reward apply only in the self-contained world of an infinite dream run.

Most advanced PvM players, who are supposed to be the Infinite Dream's target audience, are looking for a challenging experience - and the new system simply disincentives them from seeking it - why waste dream points on failed attempts when I can just get a slightly worse buff - especially when a risk of running out of dream points and completely losing the run is introduced.

Although less significant than the loss of the defeat insurance, the utilization of idols is very similar. It would be better to scale the dream point accumulation for players using 250+ idol scores on every fight, than it is to make idols obsolete to avoid scaling issues.

These changes deter players from taking on the toughest fights possible (due to the excessive amount of attempts required to complete them) -essentially removing that content from the game- while also effectively removing the difficulty added by idols (due to them not affecting Infinite Dream buff progression).

I'm really baffled by the decision-making process that got us to this point - where did you find the advanced PvM players who say "the challenge I'm looking for in the game's most difficult content are fights that would take me no more than a few attempts to beat".

It seems more like a continuation of the 2.42 mindset: "making Dofus more accessible" - which was somewhat understandable for dungeons - but making the only 'end-game' content accessible just ends up ruining it for players bored with the now-easy dungeons.
2 -1
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Score : 6112

I agree with most of what you said, except for the part about idols. I find idols to be anti-strategy. They try to force a very specific play style in order to win. For example, with melee idols, you get to sit next to enemies and hopefully tank them or kill them before they kill you. Like, that's not very skill-based. In my opinion, strategy should allow for creative ways to win a battle and not try to force a narrow set of ways.

As a general concept, of course. Obviously some idol combinations aren't as bad in this regard as others.

2 0
Score : 102

"As I write these lines, the beta of these features should soon be online."
It's still not in beta, when is it coming online?

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Score : 863

@yloocyloow

I'd disagree with that, actually. The defeat insurance allows for less skill. Sure, you can ''afford'' to take on harder fights, but what's the difficulty in dying 20 times to find the correct line of play, and win the dungeon through some loophole? I, for one, would much rather have true difficulty, not countless re-do's. The defeat insurance and the fact that everything was about finding an abuseable line of play was a huge turn off for me. If anything, the removal of the defeat insurance will push players to become better, instead of killing themselves countless times, pretending that is in any way a show of skill.

If you need the defeat insurance to take on a hard fight, that just means you can't pass that room under normal circumstances and need the advantage of playtesting for the correct play.

All in all, great change for the infinite dreams.

0 -1
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Score : 90

That just strikes me as completely backwards.

Your concept of 'skill' seems to (over)value the improvisational aspect of Dofus - the real-time reaction to RNG. And that approach really doesn't fit the game - in that, nothing else in Dofus cares about your number of attempts - and end-game content has always required excessive wiping even by the best of players (pre-2.42 and dofensive).

Now, you could argue it's good to introduce a system that revolves around that idea of 'skill' - and then it might seem like a conversation about subjective preferences, but I think you'll see that's not the case once we break-down your notions of 'difficulty'.

I think the comparison of fights like Kardorim vs fights like Queen of Thieves+Tengu Snowfoux is apt:

  • Many QoT+TS fights require you to have 8+ dofus per char and specific overmaged pieces of gear on all 4 chars - and it can be as ridiculous as needing 4 high-end mono-agility sets - two of which you might never need again. ---- whereas Kardorim fights can be done with the same lvl 199 sets.
 
  • Many QoT+TS fights require 3 specific classes to join the dream owner, out of the 12 strongest ID classes - meaning you need to know how to optimally play 12 classes and utilize any possible interaction between them in order to consistently beat QoT+TS fights ---- whereas you can use the same 4 classes for all your Kardorim fights, assuming you picked decent classes.
 
  • Fights like Kardorim always consume significantly less time to complete the actual fight - you can easily spend a day on a QoT+TS fight, but you'll basically never spend more than an hour on a Kardorim fight
 
  • Being particularly generous, we can say about 100 players have been able to complete more than one QoT+TS fight ---- as opposed to the vast majority of level 200 basically-geared players, who are able to beat Kardorim fights with little-to-no wipes


It seems like the question 'what's the difficulty in dying 20 times...' can just as easily be said about 'what's the difficulty in beating Kardorim on the first attempt?' - but obviously, I do see the difficulty there, and I'm blown away by the Epic sever players who manage getting end-game achievements and complete dofus questlines - because it is impressive to consistently not mess up a single fight. But that's not the case here - messing up once or twice isn't gonna ruin your run - yeah it's not optimal, but you'll be fine. 

So really, you're saying it's more difficult to consistently average out a single wipe per easy-to-average fight than it is to consistently beat QoT+TS with unlimited attempts - when the requirements to do these things, and the frequency in which its done by players, in a very extreme way, imply the opposite of that.

I also wanna object to the notion of loophole you seem to attach to solving extremely difficult fights. The closest thing to a loophole that is somehow relevant to such fights is trying to reach a safe rotation where every character mostly does the same thing over and over again to completely avoid damage - coming up with such a rotation for a specific fight, setting it up, and maintaining it, is a lot more difficult and a lot more impressive than merely beating an average fight on the first go - Now again, you may say 'well that's not difficult, you've got infinite attempts', but the reality is that very few players are capable of beating it, in spite of it being extremely rewarding - indeed the most rewarding mechanism in the game.

More generally, I just find your point-of-view baffling really: to see a fight like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c6wiFCtsuc&t=658s
and say 'well he just used infinite attempts to abuse a loophole, there's no skill to what he does' - but then when a player beats Kardorim on the first go, say with a blitzkrieg combat challenge,  you'd consider that a display of skill.

You must be on the same wavelength as the devs, but as someone who's online everyday talking to players who essentially 'completed' PvM - no one has ever conveyed views even slightly similar to yours - even the ones that aren't as disappointed with the changes don't consider the upcoming infinite dreams as requiring more skill - 'cause justifying that view would require really messed up definitions of 'difficulty' and 'skill' that are detached from each other. And yeah, I can totally see how there are 'different kinds of difficulties' but even then, it seems like you (and the devs) are valuing the kind of difficulty that most players are able to handle easily - and are in favor of creating systems that don't incentivise them to push their limits, but instead remain in the familiar space of Kardorim fights.
2 -1
Score : 2462

Gobyob casts Slingshot.
Crabee: -4741 HP (dead).

Why do the monsters sometimes do like 3x the normal amount of damage they usually do?

 

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