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Score : 142

Weapons and why they need something done with them.

By iamgrrr November 29, 2012, 04:37:04
Ok so this is very contriversel, But I feel something needs to be said. I am a koloer its my favorite part of Dofus, However lately its getting very repetative mainly due to everyone and I mean EVERYONE only using agi chars with agi daggers. 9/10 kolos go something like this (dag, dag CH!, dagCH!, dag, CH! dag, dag CH!) And people are never using spells other than skills, coop, invisability,flight,leap. I know its not my place to tell people how to play but really people its getting so boring seeing hardly anyone using anything other than their op 1/2crit agi maged dags.
This is just my opinion and Im sorry if I offended anyone with it but I am intitled to an opinion and thats just mine smile 
Reactions 33
Score : 252
I agree and think that weapons (add another item slot to replace bonuses) or atleast the ability to attack with them should be removed.
Score : 27221
Some of the content in dofus has upwards of 20,000 hit points. Spells in their current state are too weak to kill something like that in a timely manner.

The average monster in Frigost 2 has at least 5000 to 6000 hit points as well, and some do adverse things if you hit them with spells.
Score : 142
Revil-Nunor|2012-11-29 05:05:08
Some of the content in dofus has upwards of 20,000 hit points. Spells in their current state are too weak to kill something like that in a timely manner.

The average monster in Frigost 2 has at least 5000 to 6000 hit points as well, and some do adverse things if you hit them with spells.
I agree with you completly, On said topic however what I was refering too is pvp (player vs player) not pvm (player vs monster) Weapons no dought have a place in the game but I presonally dont think its in pvp/kolo. Even still some weapons arent that bad but dags that crit at 600 and can be used 4 times is hard to handle and takes almost all of the fun out of a match.
Score : 27221
I do agree that separate combat systems for PvP and PvM would be peachy, but sadly Ankama doesn't share our outlook.... yet. wink 
Score : 142
Revil-Nunor|2012-11-29 06:39:33
I do agree that separate combat systems for PvP and PvM would be peachy, but sadly Ankama doesn't share our outlook.... yet. wink
I like the yet gives me hope for the future of dofus happy so did this update some of the changes will seriously balance some issues dont really think iops needed another buff but friction isnt that bad to deal with I would really like to see a new Eni class spell but thats a whole diffrent story tongue 
Score : 10987
And then sacs turn into the ultimate PvP monsters.
Score : 142
XehanordHeartless|2012-11-29 14:02:27
And then sacs turn into the ultimate PvP monsters.
You know what thats a really good point, But one class benefiting doesnt make the argument that weapons are far to over powerd invalid. I think there should be a nice low cap to the cast number such as 2. Nobody likes to be hit 4 times by a srams 1/2 daggers. The fact that they can go invisable and have 8mp then pop up out of no where and take a large majority of your hp is stupid and needs to be addressed its next to impossible to escape the "srams wrath"
Score : 3818
iamgrrr|2012-11-29 14:11:45
XehanordHeartless|2012-11-29 14:02:27
And then sacs turn into the ultimate PvP monsters.
You know what thats a really good point, But one class benefiting doesnt make the argument that weapons are far to over powerd invalid. I think there should be a nice low cap to the cast number such as 2. Nobody likes to be hit 4 times by a srams 1/2 daggers. The fact that they can go invisable and have 8mp then pop up out of no where and take a large majority of your hp is stupid and needs to be addressed its next to impossible to escape the "srams wrath"
The ways to escape this are
mp boost yourself and run away (or as cra, summon chafer etc. and reape mp with paralyzing arrow)
hope they have a CF with the first time dagger and be lucky tongue
try to find out where they are so you can push them away and reape there mp.
if you know that there are some traps near you, stand in the back of it to make sure the sram have to run futher.
Score : 3966
The only classes that can kill off sram's mp after that annoying invis/skill are enus with GS, Sadida, Osa's Wyrmling (if it sees it as enough of a threat i guess. mine unbew'd a 14/9 ecaflip in kolo one day since there were 2 on that team and a sram), and i'm not sure if roulette still has the ability to unbewitch, but if it does, then Ecaflip too. And yeah, i agree that weapons shouldn't be outdamaging spells at ANY point of Dofus. I have a friend with a 192 eni with a thrusty staff, and he hits down 1100 every other strike on just about everything with less than 30% fire resist, but only about 350-500 with 3 forbidden words (160-19x per hit).
Score : 10987
I don't see why spells should hit more than weapons. They offer more utility be it either range,ap,no fatal critical hits,mp/ap lose,resists,damage buffs,map manipulation and others. I see weapons as a raw damage source.
Score : 3966
Sorry, I thought it out only after I made the post, allow me to re-phrase my voice: "I don't think weapons should be outdamaging spells by such a large margin throughout the buildup on the game." I understand wanting to have a better damage output against others as the health and resistances increase over time, but to ignore almost every spell you've worked on for only 1-3 spells just to make that weapon stronger and swing it around like a happy monkey?? I just don't see too much fun in fighting if that's all you're going to look forward to in later levels.
Score : 27221
You don't have to use weapons and nothing else. Each person has to make that decision on their own, over the long run I find weapons are just more efficient. If spells did more than I wouldn't use weapons as much.
Score : 1387
When I read this, it seems to me that the key problems here is not, that daggers (or any weapon) is overpowered at the moment. But that the many other ways Dofus provides to win a battle seem to have no place in Kolosium PvP fights.

In general, I think to make combat more versatile, it is better to provide different ways of defeating the enemy than just the highest damage output. Or else, all you achieve is that Agi maged daggers will just be replaced by the next best thing to do (e.g. spamming the one spell that yield the most base damage).

I think, Dofus does an amazing job of providing several totally different approaches of defeating enemies in combat. There are AP/MP removal tactics, Healing and unrecoverable HP, Shielding and Damage Reduction (both - absolute and in %), Unavoidable damage like pushback and poison, and and and...

So maybe instead of simply bashing on the current best way, the other ways should be made move viable?

By the way.. for every single-action tactic, there seem to be quite potent counter-actions available in Dofus. Like reducing the enemies CH rate (Terror/Sword of Destruction), casting Weakness on him (Pandawasta) or just buff up Agi resistance to 50%. Maybe these counter-tactics are too scare at the moment and should be made more broadly available?
Score : 142
Cute-Fire|2012-11-29 17:14:34
iamgrrr|2012-11-29 14:11:45
XehanordHeartless|2012-11-29 14:02:27
And then sacs turn into the ultimate PvP monsters.
You know what thats a really good point, But one class benefiting doesnt make the argument that weapons are far to over powerd invalid. I think there should be a nice low cap to the cast number such as 2. Nobody likes to be hit 4 times by a srams 1/2 daggers. The fact that they can go invisable and have 8mp then pop up out of no where and take a large majority of your hp is stupid and needs to be addressed its next to impossible to escape the "srams wrath"
The ways to escape this are
mp boost yourself and run away (or as cra, summon chafer etc. and reape mp with paralyzing arrow)
hope they have a CF with the first time dagger and be lucky tongue
try to find out where they are so you can push them away and reape there mp.
if you know that there are some traps near you, stand in the back of it to make sure the sram have to run futher.
You said try to find the sram which is the only way you can mp which is an option but very counter productive spamming a low action point spell sort of works at times but makes you miss those turns to buff. I understand what you are saying just dont think its as easy as you make it sound.

HatedOne|2012-11-29 19:47:42
Sorry, I thought it out only after I made the post, allow me to re-phrase my voice: "I don't think weapons should be outdamaging spells by such a large margin throughout the buildup on the game." I understand wanting to have a better damage output against others as the health and resistances increase over time, but to ignore almost every spell you've worked on for only 1-3 spells just to make that weapon stronger and swing it around like a happy monkey?? I just don't see too much fun in fighting if that's all you're going to look forward to in later levels.
Agreed I just dont think they should be able to hit so many times and need a crit cap or either one alone would work fine.

MamoChiba|2012-11-29 20:46:11
When I read this, it seems to me that the key problems here is not, that daggers (or any weapon) is overpowered at the moment. But that the many other ways Dofus provides to win a battle seem to have no place in Kolosium PvP fights.

In general, I think to make combat more versatile, it is better to provide different ways of defeating the enemy than just the highest damage output. Or else, all you achieve is that Agi maged daggers will just be replaced by the next best thing to do (e.g. spamming the one spell that yield the most base damage).

I think, Dofus does an amazing job of providing several totally different approaches of defeating enemies in combat. There are AP/MP removal tactics, Healing and unrecoverable HP, Shielding and Damage Reduction (both - absolute and in %), Unavoidable damage like pushback and poison, and and and...

So maybe instead of simply bashing on the current best way, the other ways should be made move viable?

By the way.. for every single-action tactic, there seem to be quite potent counter-actions available in Dofus. Like reducing the enemies CH rate (Terror/Sword of Destruction), casting Weakness on him (Pandawasta) or just buff up Agi resistance to 50%. Maybe these counter-tactics are too scare at the moment and should be made more broadly available?
Most spells that can do that much damage have A.) a higher action point cost or B.) a cap on how many cast per turn/per target/cooldown
Score : 27221
I would just like to point out that trying to nerf an entire faucet of the game just because one class abuses it with one type of weapon is a bit silly.
Score : 1169
HatedOne|2012-11-29 19:47:42
Sorry, I thought it out only after I made the post, allow me to re-phrase my voice: "I don't think weapons should be outdamaging spells by such a large margin throughout the buildup on the game." I understand wanting to have a better damage output against others as the health and resistances increase over time, but to ignore almost every spell you've worked on for only 1-3 spells just to make that weapon stronger and swing it around like a happy monkey?? I just don't see too much fun in fighting if that's all you're going to look forward to in later levels.
For next time, there's always an 'edit' button on your posts... Just saying.
Score : 142
Revil-Nunor|2012-11-29 22:00:05
I would just like to point out that trying to nerf an entire faucet of the game just because one class abuses it with one type of weapon is a bit silly.
Just my main example and the main abuse plenty of characters do it srams just happen to be the most annoying and most abusive
Score : 27221
If you got this changed, then people will find something else to abuse, and you will be right back where you started. That is exactly what happened every time things like this were changed in the past to make someone, or multiple someones, who got killed in a PvP fight by someone with better gear feel better. Nothing personal against you, I have just seen this too many times to think it will end any differently.
Score : 142
Revil-Nunor|2012-11-30 02:35:42
If you got this changed, then people will find something else to abuse, and you will be right back where you started. That is exactly what happened every time things like this were changed in the past to make someone, or multiple someones, who got killed in a PvP fight by someone with better gear feel better. Nothing personal against you, I have just seen this too many times to think it will end any differently.
No hard feeling didnt bring them with me lol. You're more than likely right. Guess I could just wait till dragon pig and soft oak stop being jewish toward me and give me turq and join the club. :/ I'm kidding I would never think of contributing to this madness
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